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Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal?
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TOPIC: Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal?
#51363
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
we dont know yet what the 'dungeon dressing' pack will have. freestanding walls may be part of it, which could solve this problem easily.
Teulisch
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10 resin sets, 5 KS game tile sets
 
#51365
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
I think the idea of freestanding walls was killed really early on.

In the meantime, I stole this from BioWizard and ran with it in Photoshop...



(A) is a new widget that would have to be sculpted to fill in a 90 degree gap.
{The other gap is filled in by the already sculpted 45 for angled walls}

(B) is BioWizard's 2-width clipped passageway.

(C) is a new widget that would have to be sculpted to fill in a standard gap.

3 new sculpts, 2 of which come from flat floor tiles being slightly modded. I think that's pretty good so far.
Sydcomebak
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#51366
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
Here's how the "Demo" looks with these pieces that BioWizard posted earlier in the thread:
Sydcomebak
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#51367
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
So... Why aren't we talking about the easiest way to mod the tiles we get to match our needs?

That's what I thought I was doing by proposing the "windmill design" here.

It seems to me that you just include the spacer(s) in the passage set or stretch goal and you are fine. What am I missing?

Well, I think you are missing that 2 times 2" * 1 5/8" floors on each side of a straight passage piece is the same as putting 2 walls on each side of a floor.

I mean that this:



is the same as this:



Also, here's a reminder that you can already make full 2 tiles wide corridors with the Game Tiles Sets as they are right now:



and I'm not convinced that this (with the floors on the other side of the corridors) is any uglier than this:



In my opinion, just be patient! The Game Tile Passage Set will be coming soon enough, just not in the present kickstarter.

p.s. Having this argumentation right now really makes me understand why Stefan is right not to allow anything not modular in this first kickstarter...
biowizard
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#51369
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
I understand your measurement (which are obvious as I already stated it doesn't break the 2x2 system) but my original concern was about needing SO MANY tiles to make straight corridors:

Sample Map

That's a LOT of sets and is pretty ugly along the top & right side, yes?

I'd love to be patient, but I'd like to have an idea what t o expect before dropping hundreds of dollars on the START of what I need for this to be worth it.
Sydcomebak
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#51371
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
That is an good extreme example that shows both the problem & that by using the pieces that you have 'left over' from the 'KS Room+' sets, in the best way that you can to accomplish your 3D design/s.

I also want to add that If these 'KS Room+' sets did have some corridor pieces as well, lets say 4 or 6 per set, you would inevitably not have as many walls and corners and floor tiles. (or the price per set goes up and up)
Then you would be in the situation where people who only are buying 1 or 2 sets cannot make many classic 'dense mostly room type dungeons' that they want to as they have too many 'spare' corridor pieces.
(Indeed with that length of corridor - which is pretty long in anyones books - that would need several sets)

You then quickly get into the situation were we would then start to see people using corridor pieces as straight wall sections in rooms !!
The way I see this therefore is that It is impossible to 'dilute' a sets main theme without loosing something.
The way this has been designed is perfect. Perfect for what it is, a very advanced and flexible 'Room+' set.

The future:
Those of us that are already DF 'collectors' know we can trust and rely on DF to bring out new lines and ranges. Those lets you pretty much build what you want.. But it is not Lego.
(Some of the Advanced Builder sets that have come online cover almost every conceivable option).

Until then it is for us as DM's to use these amazing tiles in whatever ways we can.
Your example works! As far as the party are concerned - they have found an amazing long corridor.

Black Cloth:
One trick I use as a DM with DF is to use a ton of 'Black Napkins' Just squares of black cloth. I peel these back and reveal what I want to reveal. Under these can be all kinds of things you do not want your players to see. It also keeps them guessing if there is or is not going to be a secret passage or another room or corridor etc.

dandare
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RSx8, DRSx3, DRSx4, CWPS, R&Px6, CSx3, CPx3, AB1x2, AB2x2, T1x2,T2x2, NPx3, WA1x2, WA2x2, WA3, CR&WS, CR, CLS, HSI, HS2, Rota1, Rota2, Rota entrance, Nest. Ogres Den(At last!) & various KS1 sets & Add-ons
 
#51374
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
Dandare,

Understand please that I have no problems with the kickstarter set as it stands. I REALLY want to purchase at least 5 sets, but the maps I've already got on paper call for 2 peices per 1 usable space which dramatically increases the number of sets I need to purchase to meet my needs.

I do want to see the set expand its usability without detracting from the look/feel.

It seems that hallways/passages are a weakpoint in the initial set, and I think that with a minimal ammt of molds, a separate 5-piece kickstarter pack could "fill in the gaps."

Sydcomebak
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#51376
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
I think part of the reason that passages aren't part of this kickstarter is that DF wants to take enough time to design them in such a way that Advanced Builder Sets won't be necessary for Game Tiles further down the road. They want to make the passage pieces work for castles as well as dungeons without requiring lots of fiddly bits to make up for the extra width of walls placed outside the 2"x2" modular perimeter.

Personally, I would've just put out a floor tile with two parallel walls as a passage piece. Straight wall pieces become T-intersections and door-in-passage pieces, room corners become passage turns, and floor tiles become X-intersections. You get little square gaps in some spots (above floor level), but you get those anyway when you make a convex corner in a room, so at least it matches that. You don't get any full 1"x1" squares in the passage, but frankly there's no way around that unless you decide to make passages one full square wide instead of two (which then doesn't match up with the other pieces you are using at corners and intersections).

That would have been the simplest, least costly (on all fronts) way to do passages. It's not perfect, but Game Tiles aren't meant to be perfect, they're meant to be cheap and practical.
jackattack
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#51377
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
Minotaur, I think your version has merrit, but if I'm understanding you correctly, it not only breaks the 2x2, but it's be incompatable with the snap-to-grid in the dungeon designer program which would be inconvenient.



All 3 examples above meet the snap-to-grid convenience.

The 1st doesn't match a 2" doorway

The 2nd requires 8 tiles (8!) of 3 different types to pull off

The 3rd requires 3 tiles of only 2 types.
Sydcomebak
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Last Edit: 2013/04/20 07:40 By Sydcomebak.
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#51378
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
Sydcomebak, Don't get me wrong! I like your enthusiasm and thoughts and I was proposing a Passage Set myself before your attempt here. I most certainly encourage people to think outside the box to possibly provide Stefan with novel designs for Game Tiles products. Unfortunately, passages just can't be happening in this ks! This is a Set of its own! It weighs as much as a Room Passage, people will want lots of them and Stefan cannot just make it available as an add-on! Furthermore, it breaks modularity and newbies need playing with their Game Tiles first.

Your design:



-Total of expensive molds: 5
-Leaves ugly diagonal gaps in straight passages
-Provides 2 "filing" floors that, in the context where you would need them in the first place, you could use normal walls and corners anyway to obtain the same build.

Stefan's design:



-Total of expensive molds: 4
-Seamless passages
-does not confuse newbies
-corner and T section pieces can only be used for corner and T section passages

My design:



-Total of expensive molds: 4
-Seamless passages
-Provides new possibilities (possibly confusing for newbies) to make a few "complete rooms" or complete corridors running alongside rooms.

Although a single Straight Passage piece with all 4 of its corners cut diagonally could provide a short-term solution to have passages being included in the present ks, I don't think Stefan will do that in case it would hurt the reputation and quality of its products. I mean that if the present 3000+ backers (many newcomers) were to buy in huge amounts such pieces, it would be too late and new DF corridors would be known to have ugly diagonal gaps. Furthermore, customers who would have already bought these might feel cheated when a Passage Set finally comes out. I think its better again that DF releases a complete and better product at a later date... Stefan has never compromised on quality!
biowizard
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#51379
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
A floor tile with two parallel walls inside the 2"x2" footprint, just like a straight wall piece is a floor tile with a single wall inside the 2"x2" footprint.

Or, a Narrow Passage. But without all of the corner and intersection pieces, which aren't really necessary if you forgive the little corner wall gaps at corners and intersections.

One mold, workable passages, no confusion.
jackattack
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Last Edit: 2013/04/20 07:51 By jackattack.
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#51380
Re:Straight passage Kickstarter Stretch Goal? 1 Year, 3 Months ago  
BioWizard, please reduce "Numberer of Expensive molds" on my set to 3 unless you are going to count the molds it would take to keep your tiles from breaking the 2x2 rule.
Sydcomebak
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