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Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK!
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TOPIC: Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK!
#26484
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years, 1 Month ago  
Let us know what you think!

Thanks for your pre-orders which enabled us to do this set in 2007.
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#26485
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years, 1 Month ago  
I can only comment on the CLE, and all I can say is Excellent!

IMHO, the pictures do not do justice to the cavernous "stairs", whirlpool and the door/wall pieces.

The "stairs are substantial in actual size and contain details-of-shape that allow for multiple uses and truly variable appearances. In fact, I plan to use the existing MM stagmites and rock formations with these extensively. Truly AWESOME pieces!

The whirlpool is indented (3D), but is completely covered with "water". From the pics I wasn't certain if that was the case - I was very pleased with actual piece.

The door (and wall) piece. Honestly, I wasn't really expecting to like these pieces very much. Admittedly, I am very pleasantly surprised with these and intend to get regular use out of them.

All of the other pieces are (once again) well-crafted and perfect in their design - and were exactly what I was expecting. The only remarkable thing I can think of is how much these will enhance my lake setups!

And finally, only two days to receive my package in the "Great White North" - AWESOME!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I do have one suggestion/note:

You may want to check the packaging and padding of the Open Water (sets of 10) pieces. My pieces easily arrived in perfect order, but there was room for movement of the (individually-wrapped) pieces. Just thought you may want to know.


Thanks again.

Steve.
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#26486
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years, 1 Month ago  
For the CLES:

I had missed any mention of the whirpool being 3D (and didn't catch it in the pictures). I definitely like that, though my first instinct was a little concern over toppling minis. (then I realized... they're in a whirpool, of course they won't be standing up)

The stairs are freaking huge! And lovely. Can see these getting a lot of use. Didn't understand the reason for the circular indentation at the back though until I saw the February preview. (Unless I missed something else that fits there).

It's nice to have all the corner combinations fleshed out now. I'm not sure what else I'd ask for as far as lakes sets go other than some additional 'special' pieces like the whirpool piece. (maybe an oversized whirpool made up of four 4x4 pieces)

I like that the door is a separate piece from the surrounding wall. My players tend to remove doors entirely at times, so it's nice to reflect that. Also allows for more variation with the same number of pieces (One of the biggest things I've liked about the recent cavernous walls in general)

I do wonder if DF had originally intended an additional piece in this set since there was an extra rectangular hole in the styrofoam (not big enough for another 4x4 piece, but perhaps some sort of accessory)?

On a sad note, one of my pieces seems to be missing it's felt backing entirely (I meant to send off an email to Jeff last night, but got distracted with something else).


For the Tavern Set:

So many tiny little pieces! I hope I don't lose any because they are so cool looking. However, while I understand the desire to protect each precious piece, unwrapping 4 sets of these tiny pieces is a bit time consuming ;) (Oh well, I'll survive)

To offset my bad luck on the CLES, I got an extra 'wine bottle + plate' piece in one of my tavern sets. Yay! :)

It actually took me a moment to remember that the half-barrel pieces with the wood backing were tables. I was thinking about how I could get them to stand upright to look like kegs sticking through a wall. Luckily, the stools reminded me.

Love the actual 'bar' pieces. The details on the front and back are a nice touch. And the fact that many (most?) of the items included can fit on the shelves makes it even nicer.

Would love to see a similar set done for Sci-Fi! Maybe with a slightly heaver focus on 'bar' and less on 'tavern'. (mainly just meaning to drop the food pieces and add some extra variations on the drinks)

Overall, very pleased with both sets. Stefan has made another winner (two actually).
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#26487
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years, 1 Month ago  
I got home from work yesterday and THERE it was!
Awfully big box for such small goodies; I guess the Fulfillment Center has standardized boxes.
Anyway, STEFAN!
GREAT JOB!
The Turkey was delicious, and the bread was fresh!
Gotta admit, though, the ale was a little stale; guess the barrels didn't age well. Next time, just wrap wood around aluminum keggers.
Just kidding; it's an excellent set, guys. I didn't get the Cavernous Water set this time, cash was a little short. I'll have to order them separately.

Again, good job, Stefan, Jeff, everyone. Kudos to anyone who I missed, as well.

Jim
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Jim Kratzer, a/k/a The Mad Yank
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#26488
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years ago  
Absolutely fantastic stuff. The CLE is really amazing -- took me awhile to appreciate just what it means for it to be a LAKE expansion - much harder to get it to work with the river pieces than with the lake pieces. Most layouts are probably going to be primarily Lake and CLE, with maybe a few river elements for good measure. Much harder to do it the other way around, with primarily river and CLE with only a few lake pieces.

The tavern stuff -- I'm weeping. Weeping, weeping. This is the sort of thing I've wanted for AGES, and this is even more perfect than I could have hoped for. The food items, the crockery, the bar -- it's all fantastic stuff. I'm so glad I ordered two, now that I see it, it just feels like the kind of set that it will always be tempting to order more of. Who couldn't use more bowls of bread, or mugs, or beds, or even more bar elements?

So glad I recently painted up some Reaper children.... someone's going on a fieeeld triiiip....

L
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"In every real man a child is hidden that wants to play."

-- F. Nietzsche
 
#26489
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years ago  
Oh, and one other point about the Tavern Set. Looking over the bowls of bread, I can't help but be reminded of cheesy video game "power ups," and I feel like the TAS would be great for a Munchkin-style dungeon delve, where players can restore some of their strength/health by finding strategically hidden bowls of bread around the dungeon. The turkey platter, of course, would be a great "completely restores health" token -- just as the Treasure and Magic Items set could provide things like an "armor class" power-up (the shield), and maybe a magical ability power-up (the scroll) and even a "new spell" power-up (the book).

The more I think about it, the more I think these sets provide great fodder for a quick, beer-n-pretzels game with simplified rules and a fun throwback to early RPG video games like Bard's Tale....

L
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#26490
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years ago  
Ha, ha! I think you should try to invent a beer and pretzel game for mastermaze! I for one will be the first to test it out over a nice Belgian lambic.....
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#26491
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years ago  
L,

Great idea. I would love official rules to use. My 6 yr. old and myself use the rules below when we play with our MM pieces and DDM minis every saturday morning. In fact I feel kind of guilty. My son recently got in trouble in school for talking during class as he was so excited that he beat me last weekedn without loosing any of his figures that he kept bragging in school on monday. Here are our rules.

Med figs roll 1d6 to move
Large figs roll roll 2d6 to move
All med figs have 20hp
All large figs have 30hp

We roll a d20 for init and then each player chooses the order in which he moves/attacks. When an encounter happens both players roll a d20. Whoever rolls higher the other player looses the difference. i.e. My Son rolls 15 and I a 10 I loose 5 hp.
You can move or attack in a round. Sometimes this makes it tough to kill the last figure. You almost need to surond it. To keep track (he is only 6) we practice our spelling and writing ability by first putting all their "names" onto a piece of paper and create a table/chart. The winner is determine once one player has no more figures. We never thought of the rules you mentioned. It might be nice to add those rules. As for teh number of figures we use we each choose 3 figures and 1 large. We both put the dungeon together randomly. Each player chooses where to put his own large figure and the medium figures always start closest to yourself. My son always chooses a dragon for his large and I let him pick a "funny" figure for daddy. All in all prettey close to a beer and pretzels game. Please feel free to borrow make better our rules. I am going to immeadiatly add the ale and food as a HP restore. 1d6 for bread turkey is full restore. Magic weapons and armor will make it easier to hit/miss etc. Thanks for the add-ons to my sat. morning fun.

-Shadox
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We Search our whole life never finding what we were searching for...
Over 143 Sets (Expanding), 300+ Loose Pieces (Expanding), 11,000 plastic figures (Expanding), 1,000 metal figures (350 actually painted)
 
#26492
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years ago  
Shadox,
Thats a pretty cool idea :) I hope to introduce my little one into the world of gaming as she gets older. If you don't mind, I'm gonna borrow your idea. Athough, L's idea of powerups using the Tavern set is pretty cool as well. :)

Great way to introduce the kids to the hobby :)
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#26493
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years ago  
The Good: The tavern set. It's great. I love that the bar pieces can be turned around to make bookcases, cabinets, desks, etc. That's worth the price right there. Also love the round tables and the little benches, as they have a smaller footprint and thus fit into smaller rooms.

The Not So Good: The lake expansion set. It's nifty, and I love the stairs, but I guess what I'm feeling is a growing overall disappointment with the whole cavern water set series. It's just so very, very hard to use these pieces. Previously, I had both a lake and a river set, and found that far more than regular DF sets, they were hard to use (individually or together) having just one set. I thought that the lake expansion set would make that easier, but it doesn't. In fact, just the opposite. Now I seem to be able to make slightly larger but still incomplete lake or river setups. The problem are the stones in the corners of so many of the pieces in all three sets. To use more of those pieces, there needed be more pieces in the expansion with just one corner stone bit. In particular, the fact that the expansion set comes with four pieces with stones on opposing diagonal corners but only two pieces with stones in one corner makes it very difficult to use. With all of these sets, I feel like I'm expected to have multiples of them to use them, and I've never felt that way using DF products before.

It seems that my options are: 1. Buy still more sets. 2. Fudge the corners or 3. Build very small setups with many of my water tiles just not getting used at any given time.

Before anyone jumps on me about being negative, let me just say as I've said here and on my own website over and over: I love DF, it's great stuff. I have literally dozens of sets. I helped make the original arrangements that got WotC and DF together on the Dungeon Delves at GenCon. And I'll continue to tout and support the product and the company. But the water sets, while the prettiest of them all just aren't working for me. This comes as a particular disappoint to me because they're the ones that would work best for the new campaign I'm starting up--an underdark campaign focusing on underwater seas and waterways.
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#26494
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years ago  
Hi Monte,

That you for the feedback.
Are you saying that you need more Lake pieces with "single shores"? In other words, open water with just one one corner shore? if that is the case perhaps we can put together a single shores package set. Like 4 to a package in a future shipment.
We are already planning to make available freestanding walls from the River set and have put together a 10 pack of open water pieces for customers that requested it.

Does anyone else feel the need for such a package?
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#26495
Cavernous Lake Expansion Set and Tavern Set FEEDBACK! 7 Years ago  
Absolutely, yes. And four seems like a perfect number, as it allows the construction of a freestanding island out in the middle of open water.
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