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Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up!
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TOPIC: Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up!
#25651
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
I know my rant was a little harsh and it's only a reflection of my disappointment and frustration at another company failing to live up to it's potential and falling short of their promises (anyone familiar with Mongoose Publishing's "Batlefield: Evolution" and 'Starship Troopers: Evolution" games??)

I've painted miniatures for ages but I'm not a "paint-snob" who loathes the thought of pre-painted models. Real life has encroached on my play-time and I really appreciate whatever provides an efficient way to game without too much up-front time investment. I still love to paint, but I have to be more selective about what I do. I do it for enjoyment alone and not for mass production.

That being said, I love the DDM minis (and Star Wars, and AT-43...) to fill the ranks. Are they stellar paint jobs? No. Have they improved with time? Absolutely. The growing exposure and profit have allowed them to do better and better models and sculpts (for the most part).

What Reaper has done, however, is join a race in progress with a lame horse. Their initial selection would have been fine if it appeared 6 - 7 years ago when Mage Knight was being introduced to the marketplace. Or even 5 years ago when DDM: Harbinger was coming out. But now ?? It's like Sony trying to introduce a cassette walkman into an I-pod market. Kind of a joke, really. People expect more because other manufacturers have provided more.

Reaper would have done so much better by simply trying to follow the example set by other companies (And by that, I mean production quality - I still love the concept of "open packaging"). They could have learned from other companies' mistakes rather than repeating them. It seems they're trying to blaze their own trail rather than follow an established path. Granted, that may be admirable if you have the product to make it work (AT-43) but Reaper has shown that Legendary Encounters isn't that product.
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#25652
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
I agree, it's important to recognize that comparing this to Harbinger is a bit tricky. Sure, it's fair to remember that it will take time to hone the process. At the same time, Harbinger came out when there weren't tons of prepainted minis out there. Now, 15 sets of DDM later, that's not the case any more. So, yeah, Reaper faces a real competition that DDM didn't really have. (Tough to know where to place WK stuff in all this -- MK was pretty huge when DDM began, and it's deader than dead now -- but I don't know the relative market strength of MK-when-Harbinger-hit vs. DDM-now)

It seems like Reaper might have been able to make orcs and skeletons work if they'd done something really SPECIAL with them, and they might have been able to get by with this level of paint detail if they were releasing a more exciting set of monsters. But ... wellll.....

L
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#25653
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
On the other hand, speaking of new releases, I picked up the GW Empire Battle Wizards today, and I have to say, it's ALMOST worth the outrageous price.

It's a $17 two-pack, which means $8.50 a figure, almost a bargain by GW standards. On the off-chance you can get it at a discount (a rarity with GW these days), it's even closer to reasonable.

But the hideous price aside, it's a great set. There are two basic bodies, but a ton of heads, arms, and accessories. So many, in fact, that I'm tempted to get another at some point, because there's just too many cool attachments to use them all in one go.

I went with wizards holding an hourglass and a giant tome, but I left out the smoking potion, the flaming skull, and the crystal ball. There are arms holding staffs out, arms pointing staffs forward, and (my favorite) an arm with a hand menacingly held over whatever the wizard's holding in his other hand (globe, open book, etc). There are even cloak collar options -- a hood that's been pulled back, a giant Dracula collar, etc.

These are really fun wizards, really great poses and neat accessories. Totally the opposite of Legendary Encounters: you have to put it together and paint it, and it's expensive. But it's really fun!

L
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#25654
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
Yeah, but knowing your competition should make you strive harder for market share. The excuse that you know what you are getting with our product and not the randomized DDM really doesn't cut it. End of the day, product quality plays a part as well.

Like others, I hope this is a start and not the end, with each successive release bringing with it improvement. However, if the general consensus holds true, as L suggests, there may not be more to come.
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#25655
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
Now please don't hate me, i'm asking this in seriousness. What is wrong with these paint wise. I look at them see about the same number of Deco Ops
The Reaper Skeletons all have 3-4 collor Applications average (silver, bronzey, black, bone, wood)
WotC Skeletons typically have the same number of apps pretty much (3-4).
The Warrior Skeleton (Arch 43) has Black White, silver Broonze, just like the 20004: Skeleton Swordsman. The Skeletal Archer (Angel 50) has 4 to three on the 20005: Skeleton Archer. The 20006: Skeleton Spearman doesn't really have a comparable WotC that i can find, but has 4 colors. Well within the range of D&D figures coloring options and the paint jobs on the minis on the Reaper Page look to me about the same...
The Reaper Orcs have 4-5 Color applications, WotC Orcs in the Common have 3-5, and paint wise they look about equal in quality.
The Cave troll from Reaper yeah needs a few more Deco Opps, it's got what 3? the Wotc Being U to Rare have 3-5.
The Ogre has 4-5 and the WotC ogres have 4-5 and are Uncommons to Rares.
So the Paint numbers match up and to me, they look just as good, so why is everyone canning these?
I know i hate the selection 9 figs, only two i'm interested in, but every one seems to knock the paint saying worse than WotC why what's worng with them?
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#25656
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
I think I see what you're talking about, and I sorta agree.

As far as the skeletons are concerned, I really don't get the reaction. These seem to be the figures people hate most, and I think they're fine. The shield on the swordsman is actually quite nice, as is the work on the bow being held by the archer. They will stand more solidly, without leaning, than the WOTC skeletons, and they have about the same paint apps as almost every WOTC skeleton has ever had. I can think of one that looked a little nicer, it had an inkwash that brought out more detail -- the Legionnaire from War Drums. But how different, really, is the archer from Angelfire? Compared to these? Plus you can buy them without having to hope that you'll randomly pull them, and buy as many as you want, without having to "collect." Really it strikes me as equal quality, better marketing.

Now, the orcs. In some ways, the orcs appear to have been sculpted by the same person who did DF's orcs. Sandra Garrity? Well, the DF ones are better. The orcs all really suffer from too light skin tones and no inkwash. The browns on them are also too light, a kind of raw umber tan that really should be far darker, with more red than yellow in it. Most irksome, to me, however, is the armor on the orc warrior, with that hideous gold blob that draws the eye. Whatever detail there is in the sculpt has been totally lost, and it's just awful to see that glob of gold paint. It just looks messy and cluttered.

The Cave Troll just needs more color on him, that's obvious. Many WOTC figs have, as you say, been guilty of the same thing.


I think people just developed, over time, a kind of awe for Reaper, since their metals are so regularly excellent, and for an old-school D&D RPG fan, Reaper seems to be the only game in town. Everyone else seems interested in marketing crazy, Magic-influenced cyberpunk inventiveness stuff, Fenryll and Rackham and GW all have strange quirks to their figures -- only Reaper gives us cheap, easy, TSR lookin' dungeon denizens. From that, I suppose, people expected the world to be turned inside out for the prepainted stuff, and they're being extra harsh on it now.

I understand the critics who say that Reaper's stuff can seem irrelevant in a market crowded with WOTC product -- and who, by this point, doesn't have orcs and skeletons? But I still cross my fingers that the non-blind, non-random approach will bring in people who haven't joined the hobby yet and that the quality of product isn't actually any worse than what we frequently see with pre-painted minis.

L
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#25657
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
I think that the main problem with the Reaper plastics is the issue of quality. We are used to Reaper producing metal miniatures of a (mostly) high quality of sculpting and production. Now these plastics come along, and they are obviously of a much lower standard of workmanship. It's not what we are used to from Reaper. The company appears to have lowered its standards in favour of a mass produced cheap product. Personally, I think this is a big mistake, but time will tell.
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#25658
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
Ok I think I get L's logic

But for Otherworld "it's not what we are used to from Reaper"
you say that they are a lower quality of craftsmanship in the sculpting, and it's not what you are used to... but heres my boggle on that. They are using Reaper Sculpts, they reused, dead on for the most part, exsisting sculpts, so if the quality was there before why don't these have the same quality? Is the only thing that reduces quality the material? The plastic may miss some of the really fine detail but if it really is "action figure" style platic that can get pretty detailed, and it is sturdy.
A simple paint job can mask the detial (that's about how i paint so i know)... so is it the lack of detailed painting? what is the low quality?
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#25659
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
I assume Otherworld was talking about the paint -- it's just so underwhelming. I mean, I can defend these, and I still defend the sales model they're trying to revitalize. But there's no denying, when I first saw these, I was not impressed. And I think we're used to Reaper impressing us.

Again though, I can't help but repeat myself -- I don't see why so many people are complaining about the skeletons. The more I see them, the more I like them. It's the orcs that really look poor, the skin tone is just off. And the higher end items, the troll and ogre in particular, again feel incomplete.

But I do think people are romanticizing WOTC when they say these are worse. Unfortunately, from a business standpoint, I'm hearing a lot of people say "This is why I don't buy prepainted" or "What did you expect from pre-painted?" It's those people - the ones who don't buy WOTC and were considering getting these - that represent a possible failure for the line, more than anything else.

I'll be curious to see how this goes...

L
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#25660
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
the probelm is if you play d&D right now you probably have plenty or orcs, skeletons and maybe trolls. ogres and minoaturs are harder tog get a hold of . the only 1 that interests me in wave 1 is ogre as i think he would look perfect in the ogres den or as a leader type for my other ogres.. hopefully wave 2 wil impress
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#25661
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
Anyone heard the contents of wave 2?
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#25662
Reaper pre-painted minis date announced, and full gallery up! 7 Years, 2 Months ago  
I'm on my way out the door, no time to check, but there were SOME details -- maybe it was just a teaser, I can't recall. It should be in the long LE thread elsewhere in this section, near the end of that thread someone posted info about the next wave (or maybe it was just plans for the future?)

Sorry to be so vague,
L
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